Dialectical Journal Assignment Description
https://docs.google.com/a/capeelizabethschools.org/document/d/1BR7bsmAdpj90ADpY_MKOps6xEzcBPPsMSFlSn9rW78k/edit
Please post your first response here on the blog.
Here is a sample response:
https://docs.google.com/a/capeelizabethschools.org/document/d/1a5rcujKHsxvBr00S3a4-IktA51eK2EzVfdUD-dhXraA/edit
"Jane Gallagher. Jesus." I couldn't get her off my mind. I really couldn't. "I oughta go down and say hello to her, at least." "Why the hell don'tcha, instead of keep saying it?" (32-33)
ReplyDeleteIn this quotation Holden recalls a girl named Jane Gallagher. He hesitates to go down stairs and talk to her. What strikes me about this quotation is that you can somewhat infer that Holden is polite and in a way shy. You can tell that he's a little shy by his hesitation of going down to say hi. He only says he should say hello instead of actually doing it. From reading previous chapters you can take away that he's someone who doesn't care very much about school and that he doesn't give himself much credit for anything. He puts himself down. Holden's also someone who says a lot of things as in a bravado manner. This caught my eye because first reading the book he seemed confident and didn't care what people thought of him but when reading this quotation he goes from all brave to shy and actually caring about how Jane would react to him.
Astute and thoughtful observations.
Delete"I'm the most terrific liar you ever saw in your life. Its awful. If I'm on my way to the store to buy a magazine, even, and somebody asks me where I'm going, I'm liable to say I'm going to the opera"(16). This shows that Holden is a compulsive liar, but sees himself as a very good one. Whether he does it as a defensive tactic or as force of habit is unclear. Holden seems very insecure throughout what we've read of the book so far, he might use the lying as an attempt to make himself feel more important.
ReplyDeleteGo a little deeper with your analysis.
Delete"They gave me Out Of Africa by Ian Dinesin I thought it was going to stink, but it didn't. It was a very good book. I'm quite illiterate, but I read a lot" (18). This is a sentence that strikes me.Holden contradicts himself in this statement. He says he is "quite illiterate, but I read a lot" which if he was truly illiterate he wouldn't be able to read. This quote is inferring that he thinks he isn't very smart. In what I have read so far, it seems as though it's not that he's not smart, he just has a nonchalant attitude towards school. Holden seems to lack confidence in his intelligence and I believe that's why he fails out of many schools.
ReplyDeleteWhy do you think he lacks confidence in his intelligence? What does he like about this book? What does that reveal? The quote isn't inferring--you are inferring.
Delete“What really knocks me out is a book that, when you’re all done reading it, you wish the author that wrote it was a terrific friend of yours and you could call him up on the phone whenever you want.” Page 18
ReplyDeleteThis line strikes me because it’s very relatable to my life. Books are something that I enjoy immensely in my life. And it is true that when I finish a book all I want to do in the moment is hang out with the main character, or call up the author and beg him/her to write more. Also, I think this quote shows us what kind of a person Holden is. When I first started reading it, Holden seemed very selfish and unappreciative to me. He seemed as if he didn’t care about school or about anyone in his life, but when he talked about books it seemed as if he really is a smart kid. He discusses what books really do to a person and he has most likely experienced it himself, which tells us that he is literate. Which in the beginning of the book wasn’t made evident, except for the reference towards Charles Dickens’s book.
Solid observations--Why do you think that this disparity exists between Holden's performance in school and his apparent appreciation of literature? Watch your sentence structure.
Delete“Sometimes I horse around quite a lot, just
ReplyDeleteto keep from getting bored” (21).This portrays a lot about Holden’s character
traits. First, it shows that he is easily bored,
and has quite a short attention span. This
symptom is quite like one of A.D.D. I infer
that we find later that he has a mental
disorder later in the book, either A.D.D. or
something else. It could also be eluded to.
When he horses around with Stradlater,
Stradlater seems annoyed, and by the way
he dumps his English homework on Holden
shows that he doesn’t really view Holden as
a friend. One of the reasons Holden doesn’t
have any real friends (also eluded to in the
fact that he was alone on the hill watching
the football game) is because he becomes
quite antsy and fidgety and bothers the other
boys. The reason that Holden doesn’t seem
to connect with any other boys at Pencey
could be because he has a mental disorder
or is always antsy, or both (In my opinion).
Perhaps. Is there any other evidence of this? Doesn't Stradlater also "horse around" with him? Watch your verb choice here; you aren't inferring; you are predicting.
Delete"I'm quite illiterate, but I read a lot" (18).
ReplyDeleteA line that struck me
Here, Holden says that he is illiterate and reads a lot of books. This is an oxymoron because you obviously can't read a lot if you are illiterate. He also has read a David Copperfield book because he mentioned it at the beginning of the book. He is also passing his English class, which is hard to pass if you are illiterate. So David is giving himself too little credit when he calls himself illiterate.
David? I think you mean Holden. Go deeper with your analysis. Does this connect with other aspects of his personality? Does he do well in English, or just barely pass?
Delete"What really knocks me out is a book that, when you're all done reading it, you with the author that wrote it was a terrific friend of yours and you could call him up on the phone whenever you felt like it" (18).
ReplyDeleteThis line struck me because it contrasts completely with how Holden is characterized up to this point. Based on how he thinks, he doesn't seem very smart. He also says that he's flunked every class but history, but he says that he passed history only because there wasn't much work and he'd already done work with the class books before. Up until he says this, you don't get the impression that he reads very much, much less that he enjoys what he does read. This shows a new side of Holden and gives you the impression that he may not view himself as he really is. This makes it seem like he cares about things a lot more than he lets on.
Astute observations and analysis. Do you think that this notion of not viewing himself as he really is contributes to his poor performance in school? Does this connect with any other aspects of his character?
Delete"Hey," I said. "Don't tell her I got kicked out, willya?" (33)
ReplyDeleteLine that struck me
While reading the first few chapters of the book, I had been getting the feeling that Holden didn't give a single care toward what other people thought of him. He seemed to prefer critiquing other people and finding their imperfections, but he didn't seem to have anything negative to say about Jane. Holden up to this point basically showed only one side of him; his bad side. With this quote, you got a glimpse into another side of him. His feelings about her start peeking through and we see that he does care about what others think of him. Getting kicked out of school has a negative connotation and he obviously cares for Jane, which would explain why he wouldn't want her to know.
Very true. Do we see any of this care in his interaction with Mr. Spencer?
Delete"What really knocks me out is a book that, when you're all done reading it, you wish the author that wrote it was a terrific friend of yours and you could call him up on the phone whenever you felt like it. That doesn't happen much, though. I wouldn't mind calling this Isak Dinesen up. And Ring Lardner, except that D.B. told me he's dead" (18).
ReplyDeleteHolden often rambles on about random subjects he enjoys, and is quiet about things he doesn't. He says a lot about these books that he has read, and especially for a kid who has flunked out of multiple schools, he seems to be truly interested in english. He also must be naturally good at english because he passed the course (and he most likely wasn't trying very hard) and Stradlater asks him to write something for his homework. Maybe later on in the book he pursues a career in english.
Go further with this quote. What other things is he quiet on? How do his relationships with authors and books compare with his relationships with people?
Delete"'Jane Gallagher,' I said. I even got from the washbowl when he said that. I damn near dropped dead" (31).
ReplyDeleteHolden has a carefree attitude about everything. He didn't care about his grade, he didn't care about Ackley coming in and touching everything. However, when Holden' s roommate, Stradlater, mentioned Jane Gallager, Holden actually gave up his I-don't-care attutide, and replaced it with excitement and disbelief.
Go further with this. Why do you think he is so excited and in such disbelief? What does this suggest? You need to do a lot more here.
Delete"I'm the most terrific liar you have ever saw in your life. It's awful." (16).
ReplyDeleteA line that strikes you
In this line, Holden says he is a great liar and goes on to say that it's terrible. I find this interesting because he states how good he is at something but then says it's a bad thing. By knowing that lying is bad, it shows that Holden has the right ethics in life. However, by saying he is a good lair, it informs the reader that maybe he is conflicted when it comes to telling a lie.
I like how you recognize how this line reveals some of Holden's moral compass. How does this quote fit with other aspects of his personality you have seen so far? What do you mean when you say he is conflicted when it comes to lying?
DeleteA moment of joy-
ReplyDelete"'I'm thinking... Uh. Jean Gallagher.'
Boy, I nearly dropped dead when he said that."
This conversation between Holden and Stradlater, about Stradlater's date to the homecoming football game and dance. When Stradlater tells Holden that his date is Jane Gallagher, a girl who Holden grew up living right next door to. Holden immediately asks many questions about her, wondering how she is doing, and telling Stradlater that he knows her very well, almost bragging about it. It is clear that he has a bit of a crush on Jane because of this, but also because he only talks about things that he likes to talk about or things that he cares about. For things he doesn't care for or like, he simply passes them on or changes the subject of conversation. But when the topic switches from the football game to Jane Gallagher, he rambles on and on about stories he shares with her and constantly asks questions about her.
Reread your first sentence in this post to make sure that it makes sense. Illustrate further how this is a moment of joy, because I'm not sure I see that in this quote. Perhaps there is a different quote from this exchange that would better illustrate his joy.
Delete"The little ole goddam Governor's son" (29).
ReplyDeleteThis quote that Holden thinks in his head gives us a lot of intel about his family. The reader learns that his father is a Governor, so that means he comes from a family with power. Before this we did not know a lot about his family. By knowing this I think that his father may have not been around a lot, and may have not cared for him. That could be a reason that he does not care very much about his parents, or the fact that he might be disappointing them. He might think that if they did not care about him as a child why would they care now. I think that this quote shows us a lot about his family and why he might be acting the way he is, and not caring about anything.
I think you have misread this line. In this scene, Holden is imitating a movie. Look at this passage again. He isn't speaking about himself.
Delete"I'm the most terrific liar you ever saw in your life. It's awful. If I'm on my way to the store to buy a magazine, even, and somebody asks me where I'm going, I'm liable to say I'm going to the opera. It's terrible" (16).
ReplyDeleteA line that strikes me
This passage says a lot about Holden. It tells the reader is that Holden seems to lie for no apparent reason. This could be because he either is embarrassed about where he is going or what he is doing, or that it's just a bad habit he got into. This passage also gives the reader a sense of foreshadowing. Holden basically comes right out and says he has a lying problem, so as a reader, you infer that this could become a problem for Holden later in the book.
Does this impact how you read or interpret his narration? Does it matter that he recognizes that his lying is a bad thing?
Delete"It was a very good book. I'm quite illiterate, but I read a lot(18)".
ReplyDeleteIn the beginning of the book they made Holden seem as if he wasn't very intelligent. He was failing his classes and got kicked out of the school. But then He said he loves to read and he reads all the time. It makes me wonder why he doesn't give his all in school. Also his roommate asked him to do his homework so he clearly trusts him to do good work. Because of this I would guess he's pretty intelligent, he just doesn't apply himself.This really stood out to me because the way he pays attention to detail and thinks about things is very smart yet different. I expected him to be a teenage punk be he's turning out or be very different than I expected even after only a couple chapters.
This is an astute observation--he is a character of contradictions. Do you notice anything about his language here and how he contradicts himself even in this very quote? Why do you think he is such an underachiever? When you say "they made Holden seem", what "they" are you referring to?
Delete"Yeah. She wouldn't move any of her kings. What she'd do, when she'd get a king, she wouldn't move it. She'd just leave it in the back row. She'd get them all lined up in the back row . Then she'd never use them. She liked the way they looked when they were all in the back row." Strandlater didn't say anything. That kind of stuff doesn't interest people" (31-32).
ReplyDeleteQuote
In this quote we can observe a lot from Holden. Holden is a very observant kid. Unusually observant given the fact that he's very blasé about many things. We can infer that Holden when engaging someone of importance, in this case Jane takes in many details. This is of great importance because we can deduce that so far Holden doesn't care about many people and shines them in a pretty unfortunate light. In this case Holden is very passionate and obviously feels very deeply towards this girl.
How can you tell? Be more specific in referring to actual parts of the quote. This response is very general. I like your observation about Holden's extremely observant nature. This is something to keep paying attention to.
Delete"It was this red hunting hat, with one of those very, very long peaks...The way I wore it, I swung the old peak way around to the back--very corny, I'll admit, but I liked it that way. I looked good in it that way" (17-18).
ReplyDeleteObject of Significance
Here we see a different side of Holden, one that is not full of cynical pessimism, but of playfulness and mischief. He bought the ridiculous red hunting hat in New York when it caught his fancy, and now he is wearing it in spite of its absurdity. By including this in his story, Holden teaches us a few things about himself. First, we can infer that he finds little things like this to be very amusing. His friend Stradlater, after inquiring about the origin of the hat, does not seem to find the subject worth any more conversation, whereas Holden continually brings it up throughout chapters three and four. The second thing we learn about Holden is that he is not very concerned about what other people think of his appearance. He admits that the hat and the way he is wearing it are "very corny," but he also seems to embrace it. He even goes so far as to say he looks "good in it that way." At this point in the story, his humor feels very childish, but we can very clearly see the fanciful side of Holden. This is representative of the still-innocent part of Holden that has yet to grow up.
Your response is very thoughtful and thorough. Is it out of character for Holden to admit that he looks good?
Delete" I'm the most terrific liar you ever saw in your life. It's awful." (16)From this small quote that Holden decides to share with us is that he is a liar. He lied to his teacher that he had to go to grab stuff from his gym locker that never even existed. It's kind of strange how he later tells us how bad this habit is. This is striking to me because he tells us that he's good at something that he thinks is a bad decision to do. Also it seems like he's trying to show us that he's very narcissistic by showing us that he does something bad and takes pride in it
ReplyDeleteInteresting observation about his narcissism. Reread your first sentence here to make sure that it makes sense. Does the contradiction in this sentence keep with other aspects of Holden's personality? Go deeper with this.
Delete"'Take her . . . She's too old for you.'
ReplyDelete... I felt like jumping off the washbowl and getting old Stradlater in a half nelson ... So I did it. I landed him like a goddam panther" (30).Holden and Stradlater got into an altercation while they were in the bathroom together and Stradlater was shaving. This shows the sensitivity of Holden when it comes to being looked down on. When Stradlater, who is 18, told Holden, who is 16, that a girl he used to date was too old for him, Holden did not appreciate it. This shows that Holden likes to be treated as an equal, no matter what his age is. Also, we learn that Holden is not afraid of older guys from the fact that he was willing to go with someone who is older than him. Holden is also fairly strong for a young guy since he was able to " land him like a goddam panther."
Do you think Holden is providing an entirely accurate account when he mentions "land[ing] him like a goddam panther"? What else do we learn about Holden here? Is he impulsive? Playful? Immature? What do you notice about his language here?
Delete"I pulled the peak of my hunting hat around to the front all of a sudden, for a change. I was getting sort of nervous, all of a sudden. I'm quite a nervous guy...."(34) This is a small insert of a paragraph of when Holden is told that his roommate is dating his old friend. This paragraph socked me because I would have never thought Holden would be a nervous guy. With his attitude I would think that he would be more of a tough guy figure the a guy who's nervous. In my opinion I think when he says nervous he means something else like exited or happy. But what I'm wondering is why he would say he's nervous if he's herd of someone he likes?
ReplyDeleteIs it significant at all that he is playing with his hunting hat here? Do his actions keep with his statement that he is nervous? Does the context of what happens next suggest that he is excited or happy, or that he is nervous in a negative way? I like your use of questioning, but I want to see more of your thoughts that come from the evidence in the text.
Delete"I ought to go down and say hello to her, at least." "Why the hell
ReplyDeletedon'tcha, instead of keep suing it?" (33).
These quotes are an excerpt from Holden and Stradlater's conversation
about Jane Gallagher; the first quote is Holden speaking, the second is
Stradlater. Throughout the conversation Holden repeatedly kept saying
the same phrase over and over again about how he should go and see
Jane. This shows his repetition when talking but more importantly that
he is being a hypocrite. Earlier on in chapter four he said he got
really annoyed with people who are repetitive when speaking (Ackley),
only later on he ended up doing the same thing!! Stradlater's reply
reinforced this idea and stuck me immediately that he
was being a hypocrite. Lastly, even though this is only one occasion
you can infer he might be hypocritical about other things as well.
This is an astute observation of his hypocrisy. What else do you notice in this quote? How about his inability to take action? Why do you suppose he won't go downstairs even when he clearly wants to?
DeleteA Line That Strikes You
ReplyDelete"I oughta go down and say hello to her or something." (31).
Throughout the book, Holden had not expressed much emotion about anything. He had been pessimistic, judgemental, and nonchalant towards everything he encountered. He didn't express regret when the fencing team was mad at him for forgetting the gear, and he didn't feel remorse for getting kicked out of Pencey, his school. This is why Holden's excitement at hearing about a girl he used to known struck me as surprising. His whole demeanor seemed to change. Given the way he remembered even the smallest details about her, like why she preferred to keep all of her chess peices in the back row, it was evident that he really liked her. Holden kept repeating himself, saying he should go say hello to her. He was obviously interested in seeing her again, but unfortunately was too nervous to get the courage to go talk to her.
I really like your use of evidence from other parts of the text to prove your point. Your response is thorough. Are his words here significant--this notion of what he "ought" do? Have we seen him express this sort of care about anything else in the text so far?
Delete"Life is a game, boy. Life is a game that one plays according to the rules... Game, my ass"(8)
ReplyDeleteA line that strikes me
This phrase struck me because it reminded me of when I didn't want hear all the crap my parents were saying when I was irritated. I feel as if I could relate to this main character. In this phrase we can tell he doesn't really care about life in general, but when he starts talking about what books he likes, he starts to ramble about the book which shows he really cares about reading. Also when he learns that Stradlater's date is his child hood friend he goes on and on about checkers and how they were neighbors. Holden does really care about something's in life, but I feel like he's putting a careless act because he might be struggling in life,and he does not want us to see his weakness, so he covers it by acting like he doesn't care.
You are making some poignant observations and strong connections here. At the end of your post, when you refer to his "careless act", consider how this quote really sets that up--the contrast between what he says or does out loud and what he thinks in his head.
Delete"All of the sudden...I was in he mood for horsing around..."
ReplyDeleteRepetition
Holden, within the first few chapters, refers to "horsing around" numerous times. This, in my opinion, is supposed to show the type of kid Holden really is. When referring to"horsing around", I believe that this is showing that Holden likes to mess about and doesn't take anything to seriously. He is a bit of a clown and like to mess about. This statement really sums up his rambuncoutious nature.
too/to
DeleteYou need to go further with this. Why is this notion of horsing around significant? How does this fit or not fit with other aspects of his personality? This response needs a lot more development.
"...we all had to stand up in the grand stand and give him a locomotive -that's a cheer."
ReplyDeleteTo my interpretation, the fact that Holden Caulfield felt it was needed to define his use of locomotive is strange in some ways. As of reading the quote, it's clear that he gives the reader enough of a background of what's going on for readers to determine his meaning of his wordplay, yet he carries on with explaining what he means. I find that to be a little peculiar. That leads to the question; why did he feel it was necessary to reinforce his definition? A possible answer seems to be that maybe he desires make himself feel more intellectual and not so dimwitted as he is perceived by many. Especially after the fact that his only passing grade was in English. I believe there is a theme to why he explained his use of language, which is why I felt that this was a compelling segment.
What page number is this from?
DeleteThis is an interesting observation. Does this writing style also contribute to the overall conversational tone of the book? Does it make Holden seem friendly or kind/considerate? Do you feel like he's speaking to you? Read over your sentences here to make sure they make sense fluency wise.
"Sometimes I act a a lot older than I am-I really do-but people never notice. People never notice anything." (9)
ReplyDeleteLine that strikes me
This line from the book strikes me because Holden himself notices a lot of details but believes other people don't. Also in chapter one he was talking about how his father is phony to other people. This statement makes me make an inference about the relationship between Holden and his father. Possible his father was very mean to him but tells people that the relationship is great. Another inference is that Holden never digs deep into himself or explains emotional things yet he says this line that people never notice which is very strange thing for Holden to mention. Because it gives a little peek into Holden emotional side, that he might have a complex about being ignored.
You make some very interesting observations here. Please reread the last few sentences you have here because they don't entirely make sense. Also, be careful in distinguishing between an inference and a prediction. You are making predictions or assumptions here about his family more than inferences.
DeleteHolden also makes a blanket generalization about people here, something he does very often. Look out for other generalizations he makes.
"I'm quite illiterate, but I read a lot" (page 18)
ReplyDeleteLol, ok Holden, you can't be illiterate and be an excellent reader. This illustrates that Holden thinks he's dumb, but he's Acing English without even trying. Holden is smart, he just doesn't apply himself, and this causes him to get kicked out of school. Holden loves to read, and is an artsy kind of guy. He also has some problem with his brain that causes him to do these things. Holden also needs to be more confident of his abilities.
You are right to notice Holden's oxymoron. Why do you think Holden fails to see his own intelligence? How does his language here (contradictory) fit with other aspects of his personality? Go further with this.
Delete"All of a sudden, Ackly barged back in again through the damn shower curtains as usual. For once in my stupid life I was really glad to see him, he took my mind of other stuff." (34-35.)
ReplyDeleteIn this paragraph, Holden is very unhappy about his friend going out with Jane who he seems to either have liked, was in a friendship with, or another dynamic relationship he doesn't want to think about or deal with. One thing that I noticed in this paragraph is how he says "For once in my stupid life.". The way he says that is depressing because it takes a specific situation where he is choosing the lesser of two evils (Jane or Ackly) and he generalizes it to say his entire life is picking the lesser of evils.
How is Jane an evil in his life? Explain this further. Reread your first sentence here because it doesn't quite make sense. I like your examination of a specific line here--what else do we learn about Holden and his attitude from the line "For once in my stupid life"?
Delete"He's conceited, but he's very generous in some things...say he had a tie on that you like a helluva lot-I'm giving you an example, now. You know what he'd do?he'd probably take it off and give it to you." (24-25) This line struck my attention because Holden seemed to care for something. Instead of blowing everything off previously shown in this book. He defends his roommate showing that he has compassion towards someone.
ReplyDeleteYou need to develop this entry a lot more--I am looking for at least an 8-10 sentence response. What do you notice about his language? Give some examples of how he blows things off versus what he cares about. How is he being contradictory here? Does his description make sense?
Delete"I'm the most terrific liar you ever saw I'm your life. It's awful. If I'm on my way to the store to buy a magazine, even, and somebody asks me where I'm going, I'm liable to say I'm going to the opera"(16). From this excerpt you can see how bored Holden is. Holden is aware that lying is morally incorrect, yet he choses to lie anyway to entertain himself. Even when Holden has no real reason to lie, he still prevaricates to make things more interesting. To Holden, lying is almost a game, which you can tell by the almost joking way he describes his lies. This line struck me because it lead me to believe that the reason Holden is failing his classes isn't because he isn't smart, but because is simply bored by education. In addition, this line really sticks with the reader because of the insight it gives about the main character as well as foreshadowing and hinting that Holden's lying will be a factor later in the book.
ReplyDeleteAstute analysis. I like your point about Holden needing to entertain himself. Does this ring true when you read what he wrote on his final for Mr. Spencer? What about education do you think Holden finds so boring?
Delete"Just to stop lying. Once I get started, I can go on for hours if I feel like it. No kidding. Hours." (58) This is when he's on the bus and is talking to this older women and finds out that it's one of his classmates mother and then starts lying about him and his actions and social life. This scene really brings out Holden's cavalier attitude about others. It also shows us that he's found of lying.
ReplyDeleteA moment of despair for Holden happens when he accepts the pimp's offer to send a prostitute to his room. He then waits excitedly for her, hoping to get in some practice at sex. However, once the prostitute comes, Holden realizes that he is feeling more depressed than sexy and that hiring a prostitute is morally wrong. He goes on to talk with her, because all he wanted was someone to talk to. This shows that he is extremely depressed, because he did something that is morally wrong to him, and, once the prostitute came, he wasn't even interested in her services. He later confesses that he was thinking about jumping out the window and ending his life, which is a huge moment of despair.
ReplyDeleteAfter Maurice enters his room, Holden makes the foolish decision not to pay the extra five bucks for the prostitute. Even though he doesn't owe Maurice the money, he should have just handed him the money, because, when he refused to give Maurice the money, Maurice became tempered. Maurice beat him up and took the five dollars straight from his wallet. This made Holden want to kill himself. He didn't, but he felt even worse than before. This was a poor decision by Holden, because not only did the guy take his five dollars, he also got beat up for it. Holden could of just handed him the money and then called the police, but he instead decided to say no to a guy who was willing to beat the crap out of him. He is a poor decision maker.
ReplyDelete